Thursday, December 11, 2008

GeeVees - 00: Roots



The GeeVees is a series of articles covering reflections from a decade of spiritual and religious practice, lessons every bit as valuable for current and former Gaudiya Vaishnava adherents as they are for the thoughtful interpreter able to penetrate the universals in motion.


My Brief History with the Tradition

In the early age of fifteen, a rush of sudden interest brought me to the shore of Hinduism in my ongoing quest for curiosities. It was the Hare Krishna faith that I first met, the only extant Hindu sect in Finland offering prospects for a committed contemplative life. My initial expectations of life as a monk were soon betrayed, however, as I embarked on a tour that was to last the better part of my five monk years as a missionary promoting the movement’s literature.

The escalating discomfort with duty versus absorption, combined with a major fall-out with the then-guru, one of the many leaders of the movement who later came to retire from the obligations of guruhood and vanish to the fringes of the movement, led me, now a married man of nineteen, to seek a more genuine experience of spirituality along the lines I had chosen. Further disappointments with the movement’s leadership had me looking beyond for answers — answers I was to find with an elderly Indian guru of the same tradition making his grand tour across the West.

Hopes soon perished, with less than two years in the group, as my plate was filled with vain hopes, hollow prospects and scores of internal conflict. With all the verbal profundity, it turned out to be little more than a personality cult with more charlatans than actual substance. The trail of much of the half-baked esoterics led to the old school Gaudiya Vaishnava renunciates living in the Braj area of northern India, where I was later initiated by an old scholar, chairman of the renunciate assembly at Radhakund.

It was more than theory that I had sought, however, and naturally connected with more teachers to get hands-on experience on the lifestyle and practices of the babaji tradition. A certain charismatic teacher, singer and meditator in his own right, had us under his tutelage for the better part of four years, a time that opened whole new horizons on the content of the religious and mystic substance of the tradition. Partially brilliant and partially bizarre teachings, sometimes incongruent with the common doctrine, combined with behavior that had more to it than just personality quirks, led me away from him, and astray as far as my then-wife was concerned.

In the span the year following our divorce, I lived the better half in the way of the traditional babaji ascetics, myself engaged in intense practice day in and day out, in quantities easily eclipsing a decade of ordinary practice, whatever the quality may have been. Meeting with yet another disappointment of a teacher, and more dead-ends and impassable lands than paths you could decently walk, a return to a blank drawing board had me moving on for an indefinite pilgrimage without any particular destination.


In the Times Beyond

In late February 2008, I jumped onto a train towards Varanasi for the upcoming Shiva Ratri festival. The original plan was to head towards Orissa, exploring the combination of old Buddhist ruins and grand Hindu shrines in the general area. That, and the Puri beaches were quite inviting too. From there, I would have taken the grand circuit across the four principal Buddhist places of pilgrimage in the north. It was not to be, however — not yet, anyway.

In Sarnath, a Buddhist center half-an-hour drive outside Varanasi, I bumped into a colorful group of Buddhist monks from the Thai Theravada school. The Irish monk was heading south and incidentally had a spare train ticket. Off we went, visiting Ramana Maharshi’s ashram in Tiruvannamalai and Sai Baba’s headquarters in Puttaparthi, for a two-week tour and back. I had considered dropping off in Chennai and flying over to Sri Lanka to explore the ancient Buddhist ruins and the contemporary scene, but I rather liked both his company and his plans.

Returning to Varanasi, we were joined by a Romanian-American nun and two Thai monks for a walk towards Lumbini, the birthplace of the Buddha in southern Nepal just across the border. Crossing some seven hundred kilometers on foot over three weeks, I got to know the lot rather well. With all the positives, however, I understood their way of life was not cut out for me, not the way it was available in the contemporary setting anyway. I decided to stay back in Kathmandu as they left for a bus-and-train journey back to Varanasi.

It was Kathmandu where I was based for four months, spending time with friends old and new, working with a few NGOs, exploring the mountains and the world of men in a way I had never seen it before. It was a time of great evolution, re-modeling the past and transforming into a new being, an individual being who was no longer subject to rules of religious conformance.

A liberation in its own right, it created a grand arena of contemplations for me. Thence are the thoughts that follow in the upcoming essays, written over a cool Scandinavian winter near a crackling fireplace, surrounded by familiar nature-spirits and a regenerating atmosphere, a muse and a friend of many years sitting by my side.


On Gaudiya Vaishnavism

The religious tradition founded by Sri Chaitanya (1486-1534) came to be called Gaudiya Vaishnavism owing to the ancient name (Gauda) of its motherland, Bengal. Sri Chaitanya’s was a devotional movement, bent in its core on mystical absorption and participation in the cosmic drama of Radha and Krishna, the tradition’s transcendent god and goddess. The outer praxis was that of a people’s movement, ecstatic preachers and wandering bards spreading the gospel of Sri Chaitanya far and wide, the chanting of the holy names of god brought to every town and village in the movement’s path.

The theological foundation, based on elaborations on Sri Chaitanya’s teaching, was laid by the six Goswamis, renunciate disciples of his, scholars in their own right with abundant time to commit to philosophical pursuits in the rustic environment of Vrindavan, the place of Krishna’s sports in the years bygone. It is especially the Vrindavan tradition that holds the meditational practices in the highest value, generation after generation preserving, interpreting and elaborating on the esoteric heritage of the Goswamis.

On grassroots level, the basics of Gaudiya Vaishnavism are not that radically different from other devotional Hindu movements. Some of the tradition’s later mutations, the Hare Krishnas for a good example, appear to have almost entirely shunned the esoteric tradition, favoring a public digest version of Hindu devotional religion with a few idiosyncrasies thrown in. The stripped version of the tradition is not, however, too compelling for a western audience, for one might just as well choose any other tradition that is better localized and established, being left with every bit as much substance with fewer cultural complications.

At its heart, beyond preliminary ideas of understanding the nature of spirit and matter and their interconnection with god, the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition aims to dissociate the psyche of the adherent from the present state, associating it with a sense of identification with the residents of Krishna’s transcendent heaven realm. The inner sensation of the adherent evolves from faith through various steps to fulfilled love, transporting his soul and mind away from the current world and implanting them in the spirit-identity. It is the fundamental incompatibility of the two worlds that most serious practitioners seem to struggle with.


Appeal for the Adherent

As it is now officially declared across the vast internet fields that I am an apostate unworthy of association, why would a practicing Gaudiya Vaishnava dare reading my writings? There may, after all, be lurking many a seed-of-doubt, crisis-of-faith and confusing-concept under the foliage. It would perhaps be better to just sleep in the cradle of belief, shielded from influences that could expose you to the unwanted.

The fact of the matter is that I was every bit as much in the cradle as most of my former comrades of faith, and these are the issues I had to confront as I rocked in the cradle over the years. They are real issues, and they deserve to be explored. Whether my solutions are real is immaterial; it is the questions we must all unearth and ponder in our depths. Unlocking the questions may, in fact, turn out to be a mine of potentials revealed with the perspective expansion.

I am sometimes asked whether it might be better to just forget about it all myself, and indeed I have received a fair hate mail or two over my writings. It is absurd for anyone to assume that twelve years of intense practice, and by far the biggest continuous tract of my life so far, is something one could just wipe aside as if it never existed. And neither do I see a valid reason for it, inasmuch I may have the ability to observe subtleties beyond a black-and-white model of absolutes.

The many valuable lessons of my Gaudiya Vaishnava years remain with me as an active facet of my sphere of understanding. Experiences positive or negative, they were all due coming and molded me in the ways I needed, crashing into my life one after another on karmic tracks beyond my capacity to observe. They were all good, for they were all for the good, and I believe sharing of the experience is something that may help others in good, too. The disinclined are cordially invited to exclude themselves from the audience.


Appeal for the Broader Audience

No activity occurs in vacuum, in a dimension void of connections to the rest of human existence, and no idea is too contextually bound to become a slave to its times and unfit for broader application. The lessons learned over the journey, a journey still rather incomplete, have countless parallels in the countless lives of many akin to myself. It is for the perceptive seeker, student and master that I write, for those able to extract and reinvent, drawing from the identity of principles beyond the specifics.

While the parallel themes are developed to an extent in the upcoming essays, there’s a long way for me to go until a comprehensive, or even a half-way decent system of archetypal concepts is in place. The readers are invited to take my observations as seeds of inspiration, fountains for rivers and oceans of understandings exceeding mine a thousand-fold.

As Indic religion in general, Gaudiya Vaishnava talk is riddled with Sanskrit-rooted jargon and very specific and detailed uses of context-related terminology. I will be doing my best to keep the text friendly for non-expert readers, glossing the unavoidable complications and choosing colloquial terms wherever possible. Blind as I am with my own writing, an obtuse language-gremlin or two may escape the hunt — please feel at ease with giving feedback on any and all aspects of the forthcoming series.

94 comments:

Mr. Worm in Stool said...

You are still young and have a LOT of maturing, ripening and GROWING-UP to do.
At this age and stage of your life you are poorly experienced and under the impression that 12 years of your life dedicated to philosophical research is really significant. It is really just a beginning.
Times change and minds change.
In time, you will see that yourself.

Anyway, follow your inclinations and instincts and in the END, you will be able to evaluate your own life and your own spiritual status.

I am a believer in the purgatory concept. In Kali-yuga, US kali-yuga idiots learn only the hard way, but at least there is the chance that in the end we WILL LEARN.

You are far from ripe and matured and have found it necessary to depart the Vaishnava faith for the time being, but at least you are honest enough to just come out and say it.

I certainly don't begrudge you for your own feelings.

I am not at all similar to you in your feelings, but in my own way I have surely experimented with FREE WILL and the abuse thereof and have only ended up thinking that the truths of the Bhagavat and Gita are surely absolute and most beautiful.

I am friendly to all sort of people. So, there is no reason I should not be friendly to a deceased Vaishnava as yourself, but it is my opinion that an intelligent and inquisitive person as yourself will end up coming back to embrace the Vaishnava faith in your maturity as you laugh and cry over the mistakes made in the passion of youth.

Maturity starts to set in around the mid-50's, so you still have a long way to go grasshopper before you are a mature person, a mature human and a mature spirit soul.

Best wishes and good luck.
I hope you can make it through the storm and live to see the sweet and precious years of maturity in old age.

Sri Krishna said...

Greetings!

Once again I bring you my trancendental wisdom.

They got it all wrong: I do not play the flute. I hate the flute! I actually prefer to play the alpen-horn. One hell of a sound!

Regards,
Your Godhead

Ananda said...

"Maturity starts to set in around the mid-50's, so you still have a long way to go grasshopper before you are a mature person, a mature human and a mature spirit soul."

Maturity actually sets in when life's experiences add up to a state of mind X where X defines degree of maturity. It is actually possible to live all the way up to the end of long 80 years of life without grasping all that much.

If the grumpy old devotee (sortof) guys commenting at my blog are an example of 55's maturity, then god help me please.

God said...

In other words, Ananda, you are just a snotty nosed punk and have a lot of growing up to do before you can be considered an adult. You act very childish. Your ten years in the Hare Krishna cult doesn't make you anything more than a "new bhakta" compared to the original Hare Krishna devotees that have been with the faith for more than 4o years.
Big deal! New bhaktas bloop all the time. What is really significant is that most devotees stick through the faith through thick and thin and little whiners like you that give it up are almost non-existent.

Your blog is a place of pilgrimage for crows.

There ain't nothing on this blog except road-kill.

Sri Krishna said...

Also, may I add as a general comment to all you humans that all this on-going chanting is driving me NUTS!! I cannot help hearing it, after all I am the all-hearing being. So give it a rest.

Sincerely,
Mr Krishna

Ananda said...

"Your blog is a place of pilgrimage for crows.

There ain't nothing on this blog except road-kill."


If it isn't worthy, perhaps you should be spending more time with Advaita's and Jagat's blogs. Oh I forgot, they were moderated. =)

The "maturity factor" keeps evading me. Whenever I hear it broadcast, it has an eerie connection with the writer's age. All right, we all have heaps to grow — shall we try and live with that and take everything for what it's worth in its own right?

O said...

I hope you have some good speakers to hear this beautiful music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AP30br94ro&NR=1

he said...

Your little sister's blog is very amazing. What a mind. You must come from an amazing family.
Reading her blog is really captivating.
I like you more now that I know you have such a cool sister.

Rupeedas Adhikari said...

Ananda has a little sister? Hmm, is she a cutie? Some pics of her?

Ananda said...

Eh, she's not exactly my little sister. Despite the fantastic picture, she is actually older than me, and also not exactly a sister in conventional terms...

I do have a cute little sister though. =)

Anonymous said...

A man is not mature until he has been through the experience of having to raise children and have that responsibility, sorry but a so-called man who has never had children is basically a boy still, regardless of the age.

Ananda said...

So you suppose every 80 year old bachelor or otherwise childless person is necessarily immature? Quite the harsh standard. Maturity should be judged from actions; you cannot cite any given external situation as the defining factor, the actions taken in the situation define maturity, whatever the situation may be, with children or otherwise.

Anonymous said...

An 80 year old bachelor who has never been married or raised children is nothing but a freak.

Anonymous said...

It's about life experience Ananda, something that (sorry to say) you seem to have little of, except belonging to some Indian religion.

Grumpy Old Daddy said...

Being a parent is a serious lesson is sacrificing oneself for others. Young single guys are all about ME and have little to no practical experience in giving and sacrificing for others. One learns sacrifice in family life and then if he can transfer that sacrificing mode to spiritual life and sacrifice to Guru and Krishna, then he can make some tangible spiritual advancement.

The ME,ME, ME mentality of the single guy is a very flimsy foundation with which to advance in DEVOTIONAL service.

Our Ananda Baba is a good example of a young ME,ME Me type of person who dropped out of devotional service because for him it is all about HIM, HIM and HIM.

Bhakti-yoga is about serving and sacrificing to Guru and Krishna.
When Ananda Baba found out that the ME, ME, ME ego was not compatible with devotional service to Krishna he quickly dropped out and absorbed himself in ME, ME oh so incredible ME!!!

Ananda is not a sacrificer.
He is an exploiter and that is why his marriage failed and his attempts at Gaudiya Vaishnavism failed.

Ananda said...

"An 80 year old bachelor who has never been married or raised children is nothing but a freak."

And as a fair share of the early GV movement's apostles were unmarried ascetics, does that not make you a freak adorer?


Psychoanalystic jabberdoo...

Nothing better than a good internet psychiatrist helpin' folks around! In fact, I feel better already.

Anonymous said...

It doesn't matter at all if Ananda is a Gee Vee, Buddhist or Southern Baptist, he can change these things over and over all he wants but he will NEVER be able to change the fact that inside he is a complete 100% Dork!

Grumpy said...

But, he was close to making progress to becoming a geek, then when he dropped-out of immortality to play around in samsara he simply remained a DORK!

Grumpy said...

It appears that the Mr. and Mrs. Babaji, setting up housekeeping and building a home at Radhakunda with no intentions of having children but having "divine conjugal love" without children, is not a very successful game plan for attaining prema bhakti and manjari-bhava.

Only a dork takes his girl with him to Radha kunda and builds a house with the hopes of attaining manjari bhava.

Despite Ananda's academic efforts with Gaudiya shastra, his heart was never engaged.
That is why he left Bhakti for the glitter of Maya's lovely charms.

Jaya said...

Hey Ananda, your blog is infected with passionate and abusive Hare-Krishna guys, you are absolutely right to reject them all! This religion teaches in practice how to insult, abuse and criticise everybody around the universe, and doesn't serve to become meek and humble full-fledged Vaisnavas.

Sundara Linga Prabhu said...

Ananda, tell Nala that she is a REAL beauty! If she was a HK, I would be ready to rejoin Iskcon just to meet her.

Mean old man said...

Poor Ananda Baba. He joined the Hare Krishna cult at the tender age of 15 and due to the dependent nature of cult lifestyle his personal maturity got put on hold and he got stuck in a time warp of the emotional maturity of a 15 year old boy.
As such, he was ineligible for the advanced stages of Bhakti because his emotional maturity got warped and stymied due to his changing gurus one after another much like ordinary people chance underwear.

Hopefully, now that he has left the confines of cult lifestyle he can grow emotionally and maybe someday become mature and thoughtful enough to return to Krishna bhakti with a new insight into the value of Krishna consciousness and the prospects of immortality in the supreme transcendental paradise of Sri Krishna.

Ananda said...

Grumpy: "It appears that the Mr. and Mrs. Babaji, setting up housekeeping and building a home at Radhakunda with no intentions of having children but having "divine conjugal love" without children, is not a very successful game plan for attaining prema bhakti and manjari-bhava."

At that point in our devotional evolution, our conjugal relationship was as platonic as love with a plank. My dick was completely on hold and in deep-freeze — you're welcome.

With children or without, I can assure you that tuning your brains to the wavelength of rural angel girls in their early puberties is not even remotely reminescent of any kind of life you might have lived, or any dimension of emotional maturity you might have imagined.

Ananda said...

Mean old man: "Poor Ananda Baba. He joined the Hare Krishna cult at the tender age of 15 and ...
... Hopefully, now that he has left the confines of cult lifestyle he can grow emotionally and maybe someday become mature and thoughtful enough to return to Krishna bhakti with a new insight into the value of Krishna consciousness and the prospects of immortality in the supreme transcendental paradise of Sri Krishna."


This is nothing short of ingenious!

First you have a problem, nothing short of a serious bug in the setup. You try to fix it for a decade, but it just doesn't go away. Then you remodel the same shit and present it as the core of something wonderful.

Bill Gates would have been so proud of you, son!

For your information, I am terribly unenthused by the "prospects of immortality in the supreme transcendental paradise of" any paranormal entity who needs to sap indefinitely of your exclusive emotional energy in order to feel whole in his Heavens Vista Home Premium.

There you are, left with a vague promise of attaining high levels of symbiotic afterhigh, the residual joy after the Supreme Enjoyer™ has feasted on his companionlings' emotions, they market as the Highest Happiness™. I really do have much better things to do than being a perpetual and unnecessarily humble speck of dust at someone's honey-sweet lotus-feet — and I wish the readers of this blog would eventually understand it too.

Grumpy said...

Ananda, Krishna doesn't NEED to sap anything from anyone because he himself is the source of everything and everything is HIS already.

Krishna doesn't need you Ananda.
You need Krishna.
Otherwise, you will simply be infected with birth, death, old age and disease indefinitely.

So, eternal life of bliss and knowledge does not appeal to Ananda Baba?

What is your preferred alternative?
Is Samsara what gives you a rise?

Ananda, you are talking so ignorantly that is is not even funny.

It is really sad to see that you have indeed become an asura.

Are you that bitter that your lovely squeeze Malati dumped you that you are even willing to blaspheme the supreme Lord and vilify his greatness?

poem:

I am just a little worm
a little worm in stool

but I think that I am really great
though I am just a stupid fool

so leave me to my own sick mind
and pass the joint oh please

I gave up Krishna and turned away
because I lost my girly squeeze

Ananda said...

"Ananda, Krishna doesn't NEED to sap anything from anyone because he himself is the source of everything and everything is HIS already."

It's curious how, that being the case in theoretical terms, he still seems to need to work like hell to get his pleasure potencies moving. Oh oops, I forgot again, he didn't have to do it, he just does it for fun.


"Krishna doesn't need you Ananda.
You need Krishna.
Otherwise, you will simply be infected with birth, death, old age and disease indefinitely."


So it's the old Jesus or Hell thing again, huh? And none of this you can assert as real or tangible except by referring to a faith-based cosmological model. There are quite a few of them models out there to choose from, you know, and many not as grim as yours.


"What is your preferred alternative?
Is Samsara what gives you a rise?"


Purnam Adah Purnam Idam.


"Ananda, you are talking so ignorantly that is is not even funny. It is really sad to see that you have indeed become an asura."

Hail Ahura-Mazdā, the One Uncreated Being, praised in the gāθās! "Asura-Medhā is the highest object of worship," sayeth the ancient liturgies.

The might of Mithra-Vouruna is eclipsed by his primordial powers; O Ahura-Mazdā — we hallow thy name! Accept us as thy humble minions in service!

Grumpy old dude said...

Ananda, you will NEVER escape the loving network of Krishna now that you have once approached him.

You can play the game, talk the crap and try to fool everyone including yourself, but Krishna consciousness is going to dog you for the rest of your life and you will never find happiness in material things, try as you might.

You are helplessly ensnared in the loving embrace of Krishna and he will never let you go no matter how you kick and scream and plead to forget Him.

You don't have me fooled for a minute.
You might have yourself fooled, but I know that you are now bound in an eternal loving relationship with Krishna even if you don't think you have any love for him.

He loves you and he will never forget your attempts at devotion and loving him.

You will come back to bhakti someday.
Maybe even in this lifetime, providing you don't commit such horrible offenses that condemn you.

Smoke your weed.
Bang the chicks.
Get it out of your system.

Then when you are in the depths of misery and despair just remember the eternal form of bliss and knowledge Sri Krishna and begin again your search for reality the beautiful.

Ananda said...

This obsessing over former followers has taken on cultic proportions. Are you sure he's really not in need of some sorts?

Grumps said...

Ananda, you have driven me over the edge.
I am coming to Europe and tracking you down like a bloodhound on the trail of a wily fox.
I will follow you to the ends of the Earth.
Every where you go I will be there following your every step.
When you look over your shoulders you will see me there on your trail, playing little bitty karatals and chanting "Haribol, Haribol, Hare Krishna Hare Krishna".

I don't care how many lifetimes it takes, I will follow you life after life chanting Hare Krishna in your ears and singing "jiva jago, jiva jago Gaurachandra bole"

KOTA NIDRA YAO MAYA PISACIRA KOLE!!!!!!!

You can run, but you cannot hide.
The transcendental bloodhound will sniff you out in whatever universe you try to hide.

shiva said...

Jaya you said

Hey Ananda, your blog is infected with passionate and abusive Hare-Krishna guys, you are absolutely right to reject them all! This religion teaches in practice how to insult, abuse and criticise everybody around the universe, and doesn't serve to become meek and humble full-fledged Vaisnavas.

That's not true. I've never read anywhere in the scriptures of GV that it's practitioners should insult, abuse and criticize everybody in the multiplex. Maybe there is a "be a pretentious dick" sloka somewhere, but I haven't seen it.

But hey, lest you fergit. Ananda was a pretty big "pretentious dick" for quite a few years when he was all acting the fool. He was trying to convince the online GV community that he was the shiznit manjari guru of the world and that all other GVs who had a different direction than his vision were simpleton douche nozzles who weren't fit to suck at the teat of his budding manjaris.

Why, lets take a ride on the wayback machine shall we, to say 6 years ago or so? Now at the time Ananda was battling the evil empire, he was like the Luke Skypooper of the Hare Krishna internets, and Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada was Darth Vadar, and IGM (iskcon and gaudiya math) was the evil empire - according to the growing clan of sycophants and drooling half-wits who saw Ananda and his fellow manjari jedi knight (Jagat) as battling and soundly defeating the evil empire - leading them all into a new golden age transgender utopia.

Ananda reveled in his newfound glory. To the vision of the residents of transcendental transsexual Transylvania, he was their new found leader and savior. With his wit and wisdom he let the dark evil empire have what not and not what? Cheers and huzzahs were heard all around.

When lo and behold one fine day a stranger from the far westing lands walked into the online mutual masturbation society, and never before having seen such a conglomoronation of such high falutin spiritual pseudo-osity, proceeded to call them all out as a bunch of clod hopping wankers. Quickly they assumed he worked for the dark lord Vadar, or maybe the evil empire, out to force them to bow down to their strange and weirdling ways.

But it soon became apparent that this new mysterious ghost faced killer was really a much more sinister fellow. Rather than seeking to punish them for being blasphemers of Vadar and his minions and acolytes, as so many others had tried in the past, it soon became obvious that he was out to tear down the entire shaky edifice of transsexual Transylvanias transcendental circle jerk. He came not to call them "offenders" he came to call them retards. You see, there is a big difference between those who “offend” the evil empire and those who are so enamored of their own magickal spiritual and intellectual prowess that they don't realize that they have become drooling morons, almost overnight.

But drooling morons they had become and the mysterious stranger told them so, repeatedly. He told them that the path they were on was the invention of fools, taught by fools and believed by other fools. He showed them here and there and here and there and here and there in the holy books of olde how their transsexual transcendentalism made no sense at all when the books of oldden tymes were properly magickally understood..

He thrashed them soundly upon their rejection of his mercy on their blighted souls, for he was not one to suffer such drooling peasants and fools gladly. For you see, he had been to the other side and knew of it's wondrous stories, knew of it's true and rapturous sexual wonders. He knew that the piffling sanctimonious transgender gibber jabber being sold by Ananda and his sweaty brood was laughingly ridiculous, he knew it a fraud in the garb of the most highest of the highesty high, and he cared not a whit at telling them so, repeatedly.

What and how did Ananda and his cloven hoof rabble respond to such a challenge? Getting upon their high horses, spouting their sanskrit and swahili and kichikaka, they let out a such huge fartuous bellow of such gaseous egotism and pretentious dickery , such that the 3 worlds had never seen before nor sense.

From that point on it was just a matter of time before their world crumbled under their feet. For they knew not whom they had just fucked with, and what he sought to give them. The gods of olde determined that they needed a major attitude and altitude adjustment, and the gods of olde were swift and merciless. The triumvirate who had ruled transgender transcendental Transylvania soon were at each others throats over perceived slights and infractions and offensives and egos.

A short while later after the purging of one Adwaiter (who served too bland and hoary a meal once too often at their nightly jerk functions) the 3 had become 2… and then had become 1 after the Lord worshipful Jagoff came out as being a bit too-liking-sexy-time-with-the-ladies for everyone's transsexual tastes, embarrassing one and all. For Jagoff was practically Jebus incarnate whom they were all planning on selling their soles to him so that he would bring them to the light, and so that he could afford to repair his worn out shoes.

Embarrassed at how his once thriving suicide cult had become a laughingstock, he headed south and sought refuge in the lands of his gods. Looking here and there for some old biddy who could teach him how to tie his saree in just the right way so as to attract the gopis to take him under their wings and give him fellatio lessons. Alas, he was ultimately left despondent when the only thing the old biddies were interested in was in sucking him...dry. Poor Ananda.

The mysterious stranger had warned poor Ananda off the path that he was going down many times in the past. He had been told time and time again that Radha Krishna was not interested in tuna with good taste, he/she wanted tuna that tastes good. Not heeding the stranger’s advice and warning for the potential for loss of faith, warned that the path he was on would lead him into a ditch. Not heeding his good will, well, Ananda fell into the ditch.

When he pulled himself up and out he decided that he had been cheated, not by his own ego and ambition and lack of introspection, no, he had been cheated by Krishna. Krishna was at fault, as were those who claimed to speak for Krishna. From now on (since no gopis came and brought him into their hareem) he would go down his own path (not knowing that there is only one path that everyone follows, i.e. the path created by Radha Krishna) and on that path if he encountered the Buddha, he would kill him. For you see, it was the Buddha's fault that his saree tying technique hadn't gotten him any nookie, and therefore Ananda declared that God must be dead.

The mysterious stranger saw it all coming from the start. Being a magickal being from a strange land magickal realm, he had that magick at his command. The others couldn't see nor understand, he had warned them all, but he also knew he had no power over destiny. He knew that a lesson would need to be learned before they could ever take what he had taught them seriously...

...for the bewitching hour was close at hand, and time was nigh.

Grumps said...

See, Ananda, you are so glorious that Shiva is writing a screen play based upon your life and exploits.

I am guessing that it will be a combination of science fiction and history.

Jaya said...

shiva,

there is a huge difference in what religion teaches in theory, like scriptural knowledge, and how followers practically adopt and incorporate these teachings in own daily life (teachings in practice).
if these two (theory and practice) can't follow smoothly and integrally, then even the most pure religion is becoming rotten and dangerous. The tree is being judged by the fruits it nurtures.

Pitambar said...

I thought I was going to get a mention there in that story.

Sri Sativananda said...

"The tree is being judged by the fruits it nurtures."

That's a mistaken analogy.
There must always be a distinction between the religious organizations and God. God is God, and the religious organizations are formed by humans and they are temporary, and so they have the tendency to deteriorate.
So you need to be specific about the tree. Sure, some organizations might tend to produce some rotten fruit behavior, or tend to attract people with certain tendencies in the first place, but the main thing is that in any organization, religious, business, whatever, the human tendencies will always be manifest - to be dishonest, to cheat, to make mistakes, to assert the false ego, to be illusioned.

Grumpy said...

Jaya you said

Hey Ananda, your blog is infected with passionate and abusive Hare-Krishna guys,

end quote

You never heard of "The Passion of the Krishna"?

It is compassion alone, grasshopper, not passion.

It is for the sins of Ananda that Krishna came to Earth and danced with the gopis, stole their clothes and made them walk naked in the light to see their nakedness.

For this reason and this reason alone we have started "The First Church of Crust", a transcendental Pizza parlor meant for bringing Ananda back to Jaysus Krishna.

Mr Haribol said...

Question for all you grumpy bhaktas:

In the sea of scripture-based absolute truths that is prevalent on Earth, how do you know yours is absolutely true and borne without any interference from mankind?

Pitambar said...

" In the sea of scripture-based absolute truths that is prevalent on Earth, how do you know yours is absolutely true "

Feeling. Like nothing else. Krishna is there - reciprocation. he makes his presence known, one way or another. He insists.
(This is what Ananda did not experience, or he would not be saying these things. Some, others, their fath is based on the holy name, their experience with the holy name. But that's not always ultimately enough.)
(By the way, he is not an old man with a long beard, sitting on a throne judging, he is a boy.)
Note: Or I wouldn't believe him, in god. Yes, you can ask yourself if you've gone crazy, but...[and Krishna smiles]...but...put it this way, is the world of people a sane place?

" and borne without any interference from mankind? "

Of course there is, that's what the books are full of. As years go by, and more translations and commentaries are done, of course it gets...changed. So...beware of the book ones. The internet is full of them. I think Shiva just said something about them.

Anonymous said...

" Feeling. Like nothing else. Krishna is there - reciprocation. he makes his presence known, one way or another. He insists. "

How can you be sure what you are feeling is the vedic concept Krishna, and not just the un-scriptured, un-altered, un-written absolute making itself felt?

Pitambar said...

I'm not sure what you mean, but...

They're one and the same. The "vedic concept" is too vague, what is the vedic concept? "Vedic concept" could mean anything from a million years ago to whenever the current vedas were compiled.
The vedas are eternal, doesn't mean word-by-word, but the purpose.

"Feeling" is just the word I used, for want of a better one. "Sense," maybe? - That's not much better, I suppose. "Know" is also not such a good word there, because we know there are cases where people "knew" and then changed their minds and "knew" something else.

Maybe "absolute certainty", so that it's not really a matter of faith, because faith seems to be for when you are not absolutely sure, you have no proof.

Krishna says that he manifests to people according to their conception, their perception. And to what degree. So most people who "believe in God", even if they are good Hindus, they see God as a great, magnificent lord.

Only a very few people ever get the opportunity to get the Krishna conception, of God as a personal friend, or as a little child who wants their love and attention.

Why do some hear about it, and hear the kirtan of the holy name, but still it has no effect? I don't know. Sometimes it is explained as "causeless mercy", sometimes by karma, but that's about as far as it goes.

It can't happen unless you somehow get some realization that you are just one small...that you know nothing for sure, that you have changed your mind over the years, that none of it is fixed. Like if you think of yourself as quite rational and logical, existentialist, and then some weird stuff happens that wipes out that whole world view of yours, and you're open - open to the mystical. Open to love.

Then there has to be some learning, some basis, some science, otherwise you wouldn't be able to make any sense of what is happening to you. That's why people are sometimes into various other aspects of spirituality, things that make them more spiritually conscious, and eventually they somehow get into a situation where Krishna consciousness can work.

Grumpy said...

Mr Haribol said...
Question for all you grumpy bhaktas:

In the sea of scripture-based absolute truths that is prevalent on Earth, how do you know yours is absolutely true and borne without any interference from mankind?

end quote>>>>>>>>>>>

Well, Krishna consciousness is not just a faith or a philosophy but an experiential science rooted in transcendental sound vibration.

I have no use for blind faith, sentiment or dry rituals in my life.

Spiritual science is a system of techniques that promise a certain result if the techniques are practiced.
Obviously, some people like Ananda Baba claim to have not obtained any effect or experiential state of higher consciousness in his brief time in the Gaudiya cult.

That is unfortunate.

Personally, I find that chanting the Maha-mantra takes me to a state of consciousness that removes any and all doubt about the authenticity of the practice and the teachings of Mahaprabhu, the great master who inaugurated the Sri Krishna sankirtan movement.

The inner thought in my heart of the supremacy of Sri Krishna as the absolute Godhead without a second, is strong and vivid. My attraction to the very ideal of Sri Krishna is something that I will take my chances on.

Even just a little insight into the person of Sri Krishna has captured my heart and mind.

I don't accept Krishna just because there are some scriptures that tout his glories as the supreme being.

I accept Krishna because I have an insight into his person and in my own mind can't imagine that there could be any other supreme being aside him.

In other words, I am not an obedient servant of the scriptures.
I just happen to who have an insight into the person of Krishna and I am totally enchanted with that.

I'll take my chances with Krishna.
But, in my own heart I really don't feel any doubts at all about his being the Supreme Person of supreme beauty, supreme mystic power and supreme authority.

People shouldn't just believe in scriptures without the reward of experiential spiritual consciousness.

If it was just all about faith in "scriptures" without experiential evidence, I would have left Bhakti-yoga a long time ago.

For me anyway, this chanting of the Maha-mantra is very potent and powerful and never fails to uplift me.

So, it's not about blind faith.
It's about experiential bliss and I know bliss when I feel it.

Others can have their blind faith, rituals and philosophy.

Give me the bliss, or go away.

Dirtbag said...

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 10.120

mahā-kṛpā-pātra prabhura jagāi, mādhāi
'patita-pāvana' nāmera sākṣī dui bhāi
SYNONYMS

mahā-kṛpā-pātra — object of very great mercy; prabhura — of the Lord; jagāi mādhāi — the two brothers Jagāi and Mādhāi; patita-pāvana — deliverer of the fallen; nāmera — of this name; sākṣī — witness; dui bhāi — these two brothers.
TRANSLATION

Jagāi and Mādhāi, the eighty-ninth and ninetieth branches of the tree, were the greatest recipients of Lord Caitanya's mercy. These two brothers were the witnesses who proved that Lord Caitanya was rightly named Patita-pāvana, "the deliverer of the fallen souls."
PURPORT

In the Gaura-gaṇoddeśa-dīpikā (115) it is said that the two brothers Jagāi and Mādhāi were formerly the doorkeepers named Jaya and Vijaya, who later became Hiraṇyākṣa and Hiraṇyakaśipu. Jagāi and Mādhāi were born in respectable brāhmaṇa families, but they adopted the professions of thieves and rogues and thus became implicated in all kinds of undesirable activities, especially woman-hunting, intoxication and gambling. Later, by the grace of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu and Śrī Nityānanda Prabhu, they were initiated, and they got the chance to chant the Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra. As a result of chanting, both brothers became exalted devotees of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. The descendants of Mādhāi still exist, and they are respectable brāhmaṇas. The tombs of these two brothers, Jagāi and Mādhāi, are in a place known as Ghoṣahāṭa, or Mādhāitalā-grāma, which is situated about one mile south of Katwa. It is said that Śrī Gopīcaraṇa dāsa Bābājī established a temple of Nitāi-Gaura at this place about two hundred fifty years ago.

Mr Haribol said...

"I'll take my chances with Krishna.
But, in my own heart I really don't feel any doubts at all about his being the Supreme Person of supreme beauty, supreme mystic power and supreme authority."

What about those who take their chances with Allah, satan, or Jesus? If their faith works for them, are they still working from a flawed philosophy? I mean, how many supreme persons can there be?

Grumpy old man said...

Mr. Haribol said:

What about those who take their chances with Allah, satan, or Jesus? If their faith works for them, are they still working from a flawed philosophy? I mean, how many supreme persons can there be?

end quote>>>>>>>>>>>>

If that is what floats their boat then power to them.

Every step you take in life, every move you make is predicated on some sort of faith.
I have my faith in Guru and Krishna.
If someone else has faith in a different concept of God then no amount of argument is going to change that.

Faith is something that rings your inner chord.
It is different with different people.

I had an instant affinity for Krishna and that hasn't changed in the last 34 years.

I am not the maker of faith.
Faith in Krishna comes from reading Bhagavad-gita.
Without hearing from Krishna and about Krishna, faith will never come.

If someone is too closed minded to do that and already has some other conception of God and faith, then that is just where they are at on the ladder of spiritual evolution and there is nothing I can say that will change that.

Mr Haribol said...

" If someone is too closed minded to do that and already has some other conception of God and faith, then that is just where they are at on the ladder of spiritual evolution and there is nothing I can say that will change that. "

I could hear that same quote from billions of people who believe in Allah or Jesus. One's definition of close-mindedness is very relative.

What I need to know is, what makes you convinced God is a blue-skinned personality as described in the Bhagavad-gita?

Mr. Ananda said...

Grumpy old: "If someone else has faith in a different concept of God then no amount of argument is going to change that."

Then how about we leave it at that, Grumpster? The endless, repetitive bugaboo comes across as rather worn-out by now, most blog entries with 30+ entries and most written by the same two and half individuals jerking off the same old story.

Shiva's legend was the only substantial quality contribution in the lengthy comment influx, we are all still giggling. Huzzahh, go Shiva! However, are you sure you got that savior complex treated well? I hear the new fad's prescribing a valium-MDMA combo, and many a Jesus has already been saved.

Your friendly neighborhood
Transytrampsy Mr. A. Sura Ji

shiva said...

Ananda

I don't think they would go well with margaritas, and hey, I'm just an errand boy, sent by a grocery clerk.

Check out the new hindu super hero look (complete with cabala string accessory) at

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/8585/mjz1br1.jpg

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/9853/mjz2cp2.jpg

Pics taken last week in Los Angeles

Kusuma Manjari said...

Ananda said:
"Then how about we leave it at that, Grumpster?"

Ok.
Well, maybe not.
I'll think about it.

But, you deserve special attention because your are the first incarnation of a manjari (what was your manjari name, colors and place of service?) who spat on Krishna and ran off to the vacuum of Buddhism, sticky bud and wacky European bimbos.

Yes, you are special Ananda.
About the MOST SPECIAL Hare Krishna who ever blooped.

You always wanted special attention.
So, I am giving it to you.

Heck, you are my siddha-pranali guru.
You told me I was Kusuma Manjari in my spiritual form.

I can't just abandon my siddha-pranali guru.
I must follow you eternally until you come back to the lotus feet of Krishna.

Grumps said...

Ananda Baba said:
"Shiva's legend was the only substantial quality contribution in the lengthy comment influx"

end quote>>>>>>


Well, I certainly can't compete with the wit or Maui Wowi of my old pal Shiva.

Sure, Siva is a quick-witted and fun guy.

I wish I would have spent more time with him exploring the Hawaiian Islands and tasting the local produce.

But, I got rock fever and had to scramble back to the mainland for some sense of security at the temple.

Wandering the Islands without a plan got to me and I had to run for shelter.

But, I have always wished I could have stuck it out longer and had some more fun with my fellow brahmacari buddy Siva (I know his initiated name as well).

Siva is really cool.

We were young guys back then.
That was probably about 26 years ago when we dashed off for escapades on the Islands.

He is one of my old devotee buddies that I really wish I could have had more time with.

Miss ya Shiva!!!!
It was a a lot of fun.
Great memories!

shiva said...

Hells yeah Kshama!

Ananda

Here is the savior:

If'n I was God

What it feels like to be God

Bhakta Mike said...

Wow Grumps, you and the Shiva Bud go back, man I got goose bumps hearing your sweet exchange.

This is so far out man, Dude do u also believe Michael Jackson is Krishna like Shiva does?

Seriously I want to join this 'Krishna as Michael Jackson Lila Cult'. It all makes sense now, I been searching all my life for God, in and out of Hare Krishna temples.

Then one night I was watching MTV and there up on the screen was Michael dancing HIS ass off, moon walking like there was no tomorrow and then I saw it!

I clearly saw HIM Michael Jackson display HIS unique Universal Form!

HE showed me this worm in pus, HIS magnificence, showing not only all the planetary systems in all there glory, but also HIS many unlimited forms, foremost being (of course) Michael with such an incredible effulgence emanating from his body that I was blinded almost it was so bright.

And to make it worse he started moon dancing and asking me to chant his name, he said, just say 'Micheal Jackson' over and over again as he danced with increasing vigor and pleasure.

So I took a leap of faith and chanted and was filled with visions, extraordinary visions of a Vaikuntha planet called Michael Loka.

And crazy enough as this sounds there was a guy also in that vision who said he was Shiva and who obviously possessed deep deep love of the presiding deity of that eternal blissful planet where sounds of Thriller are heard in the wind between the trees and moon dancing is the only way to walk!

I know for certain that Shiva is a very knowledgeable and advanced bhakta, his long winded posts can fool you into thinking he is insane, when in fact it is only outwardly that he appears this way, you see he is coming to you from this other dimension in space time or really Michael-Loka.

Please Grumps and Shiva I fall at your feet and ask you humbly for Michael Mantra Diksha, I was told to approach you in the vision I had.

Thank you and Jai,

Bhakta Mike

:)

Madhumangala said...

hijacked by the holy name LOL

shiva said...

Bhakta mike

You said

Please Grumps and Shiva I fall at your feet and ask you humbly for Michael Mantra Diksha, I was told to approach you in the vision I had.

Well, that's not how it works in the real world, as you may have heard (if you are offensive)you must go through Nityananda Balarama to get his mercy before you can get Krishna's mercy. So, here is some music from Balarama for you to meditate on:

This first video is interesting in that Balarama is playing acoustic guitar and singing a few songs to Narayana Maharaja at one of Narayana Maharaja's gatherings, the choice of songs is intersting to say the least.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhfX7N2pqM8&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsAkzOU5XT0&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOHvP9xEowI&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgdDw6cL15g&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HD0Dq89KTxI&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAGKLwyYMWw&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3BIHlrPLzk&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKKfa6BhXwU&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3h5NssTQWk&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dbyEEUdsBk&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OglIbxU6CDk&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PYpWgx02xU&fmt=18

Grumps said...

Yeah, that's right Ananda. Siva and me were watching the sun rise on Maui and chanting japa when you were just av aggravating irritation in your dad's libido.

Grumps said...

I'd love to play some more fellas but it is early morning here in florida and I have 16 rounds to get done before I go off to work.

Ramananda das said...

here is another legend.

Welcome to the Ecstasy Matrix
http://www.sintropia.org/download/ecstasymatrix_book.pdf

‘How do you know that your God, your reality, is not just a
hallucination, a dream?’

‘So what if it is!’

He was surprised. He had presumed that I needed a stamp of approval from the clerk of reality to continue my love affair with God.
But no, let it be a dream. If the dream is more ecstatic than reality
then don’t wake me. I am not seeking reality. The head seeks reality. The scientist concerns himself with the objective, and reduces, to the point of zero, the subjective experience. I am seeking love, ecstasy, and my heart is in control.

Incidentally, I sought, and I found, and it spoke, ‘this is reality, the highest one.’ But… you
may call it a dream. In a sense it is. But ecstasy is the measuring implement, the ruler, to investigate the realness of reality.

If one accepts that the absolute reality is absolute ecstatic experience, then we have a device for comparison. And when we find this absolute ecstatic experience, then we have a means for comparison.

But who is happy? The soul – every soul desires ananda, bliss.

Sir Haribol said...

" I have 16 rounds to get done before I go off to work. "

This is one of the reasons I am mighty sceptical of the usefulness of rituals, no matter how many people decide to invest in them.

Grumps said...

Sir Haribol said...
" I have 16 rounds to get done before I go off to work. "

This is one of the reasons I am mighty sceptical of the usefulness of rituals, no matter how many people decide to invest in them.

end quote>>>>


But, I do it because I enjoy it, not because I have to.
I do because it makes me feel great for the rest of the day.
So, I am addicted.
It is not a ritual.
It is an addiction.

Pitambar said...

harinam, hare krishna mahamantra, is not a ritual. and it has nothing to do with what other people do or don't do.

Mr Haribol said...

What if one can manage to feel great and spiritual without reciting anything? Would you still say to them they are not on the right path?

Grumps said...

Mr Haribol said...
What if one can manage to feel great and spiritual without reciting anything? Would you still say to them they are not on the right path?

end quote>>>>

In the forest of material illusion there are many paths leadings to many different destinations.
I would say they are on a path but not THE path.
They are on a path to somewhere, but it would not be to Krishna.

On the path to Krishna, you must chant his names as per according to the directions of guru and shastra.

All paths don't lead to same destination.
If your idea of God is something other than Krishna, then of course you will not go in his direction and subsequently will not get to him.

So, I would say no.
If someone doesn't chant the Holy Name of Krishna, then he is not on the path to Krishna, but on the path to somewhere uncertain.

I would say that outside of Vaishnavism that most religions teach a very vague and undefined conception of God and the kingdom of God.

So, their path leads to somewhere vague and undefined.
On the path to Krishna you know what God looks like and what planet he lives on and many details about him and his planet.

You don't find that in other religions.
In other religions God is unknown and unknowable and information about his planet is non-existent.

So, without some road map and descriptions of the destination, the path of other faiths leads into the great unknown.

That sounds a little scary to me.
Walking on a path to somewhere you have no real information about seems to me to be a rather risky idea.

Mr Haribol said...

How many supreme beings are there? If one is persistant in their quest to move closer to God, do the rituals matter? Is God really deaf and blind to every other kind of worship, apart from one which stems from ancient India?

To me, it would be scary to dedicate my life on the instructions of ancient books. There are many to choose from. Why would God demand me to perform any kind of rituals in the first place?

I mean, I could write a book right now, a basis for a new religion, freeze it using cryogenic procedures. It could be discovered in, say, 3000 AD to make it ancient enough. If people reacted to it and started acting according to MY instructions, would they attain God?

Grumps said...

Mr Haribol said...
How many supreme beings are there? If one is persistant in their quest to move closer to God, do the rituals matter?

end quote>>>>

You obviously have a closed mind and aren't really interested in learning anything about God from the Vaishnava canon.

I am not going to argue with you as you appear to already have all the answers and aren't open to any new information about God or how to get to him in his Kingdom.

Arguing with someone who already thinks they know it all and aren't really interested in learning but only wants to argue and advocate their own "path" is not anything I am interested to do.

I do respond to sincere questions, but I am not going to argue with a know-it-all who is here to preach his own self-made process of God realization.

I don't follow a self-made process.
I follow the ancient and modern sages of India.

If you think you are so much wiser and more realized then good for you.

I am a student, not a master.
I have much to learn and my mind is open.

Your mind is obviously closed and you presume to already know the path and the truth, so arguing with you is a waste of time.

I have 16 rounds to chant and I don't have any more time this morning for writing responses to your challenges to the Vedic authority.

Good luck on your path to wherever it is you are going.

More than likely you are simply on the path to personal gratification and the pursuit or material happiness.
That is not what religion is supposed to be about.

Mr Haribol said...

Pardon my smile.

" Your mind is obviously closed and you presume to already know the path and the truth, so arguing with you is a waste of time. "

Ahem. Who's mind is closed? Did I suggest I have found the one true path? Or was it someone else perhaps? I don't claim to know the ultimate truth. I'm simply being cautious and not barging in to a specific set of beliefs. Unlike some.

" More than likely you are simply on the path to personal gratification and the pursuit or material happiness. "

Ah, the demonization-card.

Your approach reflects poorly on the philosophy you represent. Little do you know I am an ascetic who spends hours every day in meditation and couldn't care less about material happiness. I don't even own a television, for crying out loud.

Good luck on YOUR path, sire.

It said...

Mr Haribol said:

Little do you know I am an ascetic who spends hours every day in meditation.

end quote>>>>>

what do you meditate on?
Meditating on empty space is a waste of time.

Rocks meditate.
Statues meditate.
Trees meditate.
Men on the beach meditate on women in bikinis.
Murderers meditate on how to kill an innocent person.

The object of meditation is all important.

Meditating on the jumbled rubbish that flows through a conditioned mind is not anything spiritual.


If the object of your meditation is not transcendental reality, then you are simply meditating like a tree in the forest.

Mr Haribol said...

If trees meditate, it is only to the effect they know they are one with the universe. To attain compassion and oneness is a worthwhile goal for anyone, rock, tree, man included.

Even if one abstained from the mantra does not mean they are automatically immersed in ideas of bikinis or murder.

The question is, what proves the superiority of one holy book over another, as many were given to mankind during our history.

And another on whether meditation on transcendental realities is only possible through a specific belief system. I'm yet to see the evidence.

All this is not to say I wan't to "convert" anyone to anything. I don't care what people do as long as they don't harm anyone. But all organized religions have a thing or two to explain when it comes to authority an who can claim the ultimate position.

So far, the only reasonable philosophical position in my opinion is one of genuine openness combined with a cautious approach to holy canons of any kind.

One hand clapping said...

Mr Haribol,

What is then your goal?
What is the destination you seek to attain?
What is your idea of spiritual existence and the nature of eternal spiritual perfection?

What do you seek to accomplish through your "meditation".

You still haven't explained what you meditate upon.

How would you want to spend eternity if in fact you could attain to eternal existence beyond the material existence?

See, you don't play fair.

You refuse to explain your goals in spiritual life, what your conception of the supreme truth is and what you hope to accomplish through your meditation.

The Vaishnava position is well documented and explained.

Your position is vague, abstract and undefined from anything we can decipher from what your write.

So, I would have to say you are a cheater unless and until you can explain in detail your goals in your pursuit of truth, the perfections you hope to attain and what exactly is your place in the universe other than as a meditator on the oneness of the universe.

Until you can define your goals and your version of perfection, you are a cheater with an agenda and NOT a pilgrim on a journey.

Mr Haribol said...

My conception of the supreme truth is it will be revealed to the seeker, during the course of several lifetimes. My only "vagueness" stems from a healthy scepticism to holy books, as I have explained.

If you really twist my arm I would say God demands nothing from us. There is a "way to go" but it is not based on rituals. The rituals are not the point (see previous paragraph and postings). Compassion and oneness are attainable whether we perform rituals or not. That is not to say compassion couldn't be reached through organized religion. For some it works.

As for blindly accepting the dogma of any given belief system, I would take it easy. Whether I want to build orphanages four hours a day or chant that all time is up to me. Our time on this planet is limited.

Grumps said...

Mr Haribol,

Life is a ritual.
You perform you rituals daily; bathing, dressing, eating and excreting.
Everybody performs rituals.
Your so-called meditation is a ritual.

The different is that you perform your rituals in self-worship and the Vaishnavas perform rituals in worship of their deity.

Life is a ritual.
But whether that ritual is done for self-worship or worship of Krishna is the choice we all have to make.

Mr Haribol said...

Every activity can be seen as a ritual, but the priorities of these rituals have to be based on true knowledge. Just because it "says so" and "it's ancient knowledge" doesn't make it absolute. Also, the non-worship of Krishna doesn't automatically mean self-worship. Mother Theresa probably didn't worship Krishna and neither did a whole bunch on unselfish people dedicated to helping their fellow man.

Grumps said...

You know, Mr. Haribol, the most intriguing question that puzzles me is "why is there anything"?
Why does anything exist?
Where did God come from?
How did God come into being?
If God is the first, original and supreme person, then how did God come into existence?

It's obvious that the world exists.
It's obvious that I exist.
It's apparent that you exist.
But why?

And, if the material world does exist, then why can't there be a transcendental world of planets, life forms of animated living beings and all such varieties we find in the phenomenal realm?


But, again, the most intriguing question of all is if there is a God (and I believe there is), then why?
How?
How did the first unit of consciousness come into being.

Why is there anything?
Why isn't voidness,nothingness and non-existence the absolute reality.

Then again, if voidness was everything, then it couldn't even be called reality, because voidness is nothing.

Ultimately, we arrive at he conclusion that existence, reality and any Absolute Supreme Being that is behind it all is all inconceivable to the human mind.

But, if in anything or anyone we as human beings sense as a higher intelligence and higher consciousness than ourselves, we will be inclined to offer homage and service there.

That is only natural.

So, we as human beings are all in a game of follow the leader.

Who is that leader is of course seen differently by different people.

You are also playing follow the leader, that is unless you think that you are the most learned and spiritual person on the planet.

If you don't follow anyone else, then of course you are saying that you are supreme, have it all figured out and should yourself be the guru of the universe.

We want the absolute to come within our fist.
We want to contain, constrain and confine the absolute to our personal limited mental ability.

As such, we are fools

Mr. Ananda - The International Man of Mystery said...

Mr. Haribol: How many supreme beings are there? If one is persistant in their quest to move closer to God, do the rituals matter?

end quote>>>>

Grumpy: You obviously have a closed mind and aren't really interested in learning anything about God from the Vaishnava canon.


As it happens, at this blog we foster an atmosphere of open and rational inquiry into matters of religion. If you intend to be preaching with a straight jacket on, may I suggest you take your baggage and unload somewhere else.

Whatever this blog may be, I do not intend to let it evolve into a den of fundie preachers. As of late, most blog comments have been so boring I've skimmed through them without reading the bulk of it.

Everyone's pretty much tired of the same old wanking, we've seen the whole process and it reveals nothing new, Mr. Grumpy. Don't let your fun'n'games be on the expense of the remaining audience still not clinically brain-damaged.

Mr. Ananda - The International Man of Mystery said...

A really sorry and resentful "oops" for deleting that last comment down there.

Grumps-a-buddhi said...

Well, Mr. International man of mystery. I have had about all the fun I can have here on your blog and it is time to move on.
There are bigger fish to fry out there in the cyber world of spiritual seeking.
You have become of no further interest to me.

Good luck with your blog.
Best wishes on your journey and your path.

some siddha-pranali guru you turned out to be......

can I have a refund?

Mr. Ananda said...

Ksamagrumpy said: Well, Mr. International man of mystery. I have had about all the fun I can have here on your blog and it is time to move on.

You have become of no further interest to me.


I just wanted to copy the above for future record and highlight it for others to register.

Then you don't mind if I set up a widget that henceforth announces all readers when you check in at half-satori and keeps a public counter of your daily anonymous visits?

A two-hour break in hits would be proof positive of your chanting those sixteen sexy rounds that keep you all movin'-a-shakin' in the magic world of international internet hunks.

Lord Widget said...

Mr. Ananda said:

"Then you don't mind if I set up a widget that henceforth announces all readers when you check in at half-satori and keeps a public counter of your daily anonymous visits?"

end quote>>>>>

Well, If I get my own personalized widget to announce my hits on the blog, then I guess I will have to stay around and check the accuracy of your widget.

Heck, how many people get their own widget dedicated to their patronage?

Let's do it.

When does my widget get started?

Am I still at the same IP address I was at this morning?

Or, an I on a laptop as some remote location?

How much does the ALL-Knowing wizard of widgets Mr. Ananda really know?

Am I even the same guy you think I am or am I across the street watching your from a window?

shiva said...

(from Dancing the Dream by michael jackson)


It's strange that God doesn't mind expressing Himself/Herself in all the religions of the world, while people still cling to the notion that their way is the only right way. Whatever you try to say about God, someone will take offense, even if you say everyone's love of God is right for them.

For me the form God takes is not the most important thing. What's most important is the essence. My songs and dances are outlines for Him to come in and fill. I hold out the form. She puts in the sweetness.

I've looked up at the night sky and beheld the stars so intimately close, it was as if my grandmother had made them for me. "How rich, how sumptuous," I thought. In that moment I saw God in His creation. I could as easily have seen Her in the beauty of a rainbow, the grace of a deer bounding through a meadow, the truth of a father's kiss. But for me the sweetest contact with God has no form. I close my eyes, look within, and enter a deep soft silence. The infinity of God's creation embraces me. We are one.

***

Consciousness expresses itself through creation. This world we live in is the dance of the creator. Dancers come and go in the twinkling of an eye but the dance lives on. On many an occasion when I'm dancing, I've felt touched by something sacred. In those moments, I've felt my spirit soar and become one with everything that exists. I become the stars and the moon. I become the lover and the beloved. I become the victor and the vanquished. I become the master and the slave. I become the singer and the song. I become the knower and the known. I keep on dancing and then, it is the eternal dance of creation. The creator and creation merge into one wholeness of joy.

I keep on dancing and dancing... and dancing, until there is only... the dance.

Malcolm Eks said...

Here's proof!
Three hicks from Texas shot a pair of mating Sasquatches, but because they were so human-like they were afraid to tell anyone and buried them in the woods.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4sQePBTMAU

Super Grumps said...

Where's my widget?

Don't tell me Ananda is going back on his word?

Lakshanamananda said...

Watch this space.
I think M will be seriously considering "moderating" the Comments next time, to avoid any further manifestation of harinam.

Mr. Ananda said...

Grumpy: "Where's my widget? Don't tell me Ananda is going back on his word?"

Oh, I wouldn't! Your own private midget-widget is now in place in the sidebar. And I put you in good company, how'bout that!

Anonymous said...

bunch of loosers ------ cant stick to the topic of the article

shitheads

Vegman said...

About the widget. I see the symbolism and I think it it quite accurate. It shows the really smart guy (Kshamabuddhi) surrounded by midgets.
The symbolism means that on this blog I am a mental giant surrounded by mental midgets.
Very good.
I like the widget.

Mr. Ananda said...

The lady of the house sitting beside me reckons Mr. Grumps might be suffering from homoerotic attraction towards moi, que ditez-vous?

Vegman said...

Mr. Ananda said...
The lady of the house sitting beside me reckons Mr. Grumps might be suffering from homoerotic attraction towards moi, que ditez-vous?

end quote>>>>

Well, you would have to shave the beard and mustache and be able to rasa dance with me on the banks of the Yamuna.
Do you play the flute and wear a girdle of gold and jewels?

Can you created unlimited goddesses simply by desiring such?

Vegman said...

Yeah, I am just a gay, limp wristed sissy.

Here is what I do for fun.
I am a fan of MMA.
I also trained in martial arts when I was a young man.

http://www.ufc.com/

Here is my obsession.

Sebastian Wewelsburg said...

I read the whole lot, some parts I hated, some loved, and most ignored.

Would love to meet you before my time is due.

Sebastian

Mr. Ananda said...

Hey, whenever the paths cross.

How I look at myself... Love bits, hate bits, ignore most seems like a fair policy?

Vegman said...

Santa Claus is from the North Pole, not Finland.
I don't know where you get your mythology from, but in America Santa Claus is from the North Pole.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus

Vegman said...

Keep the beard Ananda and gain a few pounds and then when you are about 60 years old and your beard is gray you can get a job at the mall as Santa.
But, it is just seasonal work.
Off season you will probably have to smuggle computer processors into India to make some good money.

Mr. Ananda said...

"Santa Claus is from the North Pole, not Finland.
I don't know where you get your mythology from, but in America Santa Claus is from the North Pole."


And you actually got that out of Wikipedia, huh? You need to dig deeper, much deeper.

The actual base of operations is still intact in the north-eastern Soviet-Finnish border. North Pole was set up during the cold war as a public relations headquarters to prevent the American public from unnecessarily defaming Sant Nikolaus, who was a good pal with both the Founding Fathers (and Illuminati) and the Russian Tzar dynasty.

(His ties with the Bin Laden family and on Christmas presents built with dirty oil money are covered in an upcoming exposé installment at Uma's blog.)

Vegman said...

See, that is why I am your disciple following you all over the universe.
You always know a lot more than me.

Damn, why couldn't I have been smart like you?

Vegman said...

But, some people chant Hare Krishna.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFvzM75NkYs&feature=related

Lakshanamananda baba said...

Gopâl Chakraborti lived in Goud. He was an executive of the Badshah. He was very handsome, young and learned.

He could not tolerate the statement that ‘even the shadow of the Holy Name grants liberation’. He said angrily, “When one performs austerities for crores of lifetimes, one realizes Brahman, and then one gets liberation. And just see what he [Haridâs] is saying! How can one get that same liberation only by the shadow of the Holy Name? I tell you, O learned scholars, this is emotional gibberish!”

Haridâs said humbly, “Why do you doubt? The Shâstras proclaim that the shadow of the Holy Name gives Mukti. However, the pleasure of Mukti is nothing as compared to the immense joy of Bhakti. As a result, the devotees do not accept Mukti.”

Gopal said with arrogance, “If Nâmâbhâs cannot result in liberation; I shall cut off your nose.”

Haridâs said, “Sure. If Nâmâbhâs cannot grant Mukti, you must cut off my nose.”

Hearing this, the assembly started lamenting. Majumdar scolded Gopal and said he should be ashamed of himself. Balarâm, the priest also chastised him, “You stupid fellow! Do you know anything about Bhakti? How dare you insult Haridâs Thâkur! You will surely perish – no good can befall you.”

Haridâs arose and left the place, while Majumdar threw Gopal out of his job. He, along with other members of the assembly fell at Haridâs’s feet.

Haridâs smiled and said sweetly, “What is your folly? This young man is ignorant. He too is not at fault, he just likes to argue, and that is all. However, he should realize that one cannot comprehend the glory of the Holy Name by argumentative logic. How will he know the Truth?"

Anonymous said...

i dont understand why Ananda should go back to GV-lifestyle at all. he has chosen a path, let him continue his journey. let things evolve on their own, we are all filling our destinies anyway.

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